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Jasu
Dropped
Joined: 30 Sep 2007
Posts: 211
Location: Finland
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 Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:36 pm Post subject: |
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| stefan wrote: | 1 bar is 1 kilo per square cm. so if you have a force of 200 kilo multiply by 5 becouse of the swingarm =1000 kilo, and the surface from the airbag is something about 20 square cm?? so that makes already 50 bar of pressure 
or did i miscalculated? |
Miscalculated. Thiswayround You must divide-by-five, I mean there You find reason for these really stiff springs..! If there is 10bar pressure enough in wheel, that makes 50bar after swingarm...
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Jacobus_XIII
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Joined: 01 Jul 2007
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:40 pm Post subject: |
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| Jacobus_XIII wrote: | | Olli wrote: | Jasu, the thing here is that he is not going to use air presure cylinders.
He is using air bags. Its totally different thing. These bags are in use at
many, many custom cars around the world, and also in Busses & Trucks.
| Jasu wrote: | | IRemember that with 2cv suspension, there is need to use about five times more force than "normal" suspension..! |
I know that 2cv springs are strong but I dont believe that 2cv's springs are
5times bigger than normal cars
-Olli |
I also think that 2cv springs are much stronger than normal springs.
If your wheel is lifted by 10 cm the spring is only expand a few cm. So the spring has to be a lot stiffer than a "normal" spring. |
If lowing your 2cv 10cm takes about 2cm of screw thread, the 5 times stiffer springs are correct. |
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Olli
Soviet-Finn Photoshoper
Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2146
Location: Soviet-Finland
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| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Jacobus_XIII wrote: |
If lowing your 2cv 10cm takes about 2cm of screw thread, the 5 times stiffer springs are correct. |
| Jasu wrote: | | If there is 10bar pressure enough in wheel, that makes 50bar after swingarm... |
But, normal car is not so light as 2cv.
-Olli
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Last edited by Olli on Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:56 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Jacobus_XIII
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Joined: 01 Jul 2007
Posts: 44
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| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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| Jasu wrote: | | stefan wrote: | 1 bar is 1 kilo per square cm. so if you have a force of 200 kilo multiply by 5 becouse of the swingarm =1000 kilo, and the surface from the airbag is something about 20 square cm?? so that makes already 50 bar of pressure
or did i miscalculated? |
Miscalculated. Thiswayround You must divide-by-five, I mean there You find reason for these really stiff springs..! If there is 10bar pressure enough in wheel, that makes 50bar after swingarm... |
No, your first calculation was right. The spring need to be stiffer because of the arm. |
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Olli
Soviet-Finn Photoshoper
Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2146
Location: Soviet-Finland
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| Posted: Mon Oct 06, 2008 11:59 pm Post subject: |
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And that 150psi was maximum of the meter.
Some where I read that heavy duty (for trucks) bags can stand 600psi. (40bar)
In VW forum they were putting 4" diameter bags on cars, those can
carry 1500 lbs (=680kg)
And if 2cv has problems whit weight, that place where connection bar
comes in arm can be extended few centimeter..?
-Olli
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JuanNavarro
Dropped
Joined: 16 Feb 2008
Posts: 171
Location: Madrid (Spain)
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| Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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The 2cv springs have a constant of 18kg/mm and 15kg/mm for front and rear. and a maximum travel (block) of 70 mm and 80 mm respectively that means 1200kg aprox.
But i dont know where is the equilibrium point when mounted, can be estimated to be in the middle that is 600kg, but probably lower. |
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daniel
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Joined: 09 Jul 2008
Posts: 11
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| Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 2:50 pm Post subject: |
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in the picture the air bag is 18 cm long
max. 20 cm
min.12 cm |
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Jasu
Dropped
Joined: 30 Sep 2007
Posts: 211
Location: Finland
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| Posted: Tue Oct 07, 2008 3:15 pm Post subject: |
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Do You have any specifications of these air bags, how much force they can create in wich operating pressure..?
I tried to find any info from their website, but I cannot find anything else than some photos of them...
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daniel
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Posts: 11
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crazy belgian
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Joined: 25 Nov 2008
Posts: 45
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| Posted: Thu Nov 27, 2008 11:45 pm Post subject: |
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i am building my channeled 2CV with airride and i will be using aircilinders mounted in the original position of the springs ,i have my doubts with how the bags are mounted in the galva chassis because it has to be airtight and i think he cannot achieve it with his construction because the connecting rod to the swingarm has to go thru the airbag and the connecting rod will make a diagonal and axial movement and i think it is not possible to make or keep it airtight .That is why i have chosen for air cilinders because you have two ports on top and bottom and i will make a long fork that will take the axial and diagonal movement .I am also changing the front swing arm attatchment a litlebit for about 4 cm so i will have more length or torque on the arm .The cilinders are 100mm diameter and i can buy quite a lot of them and those are not expensive because i know someone who has a lot of stock of airride parts that has to go .
By the way i already homebuilt a airride supension on a Audi A4 with airbags on the original struts and i could set 15 bar pressure on these bags without breaking them ,those were 80mm diameter. |
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Wonderi
Snailer
Joined: 20 Aug 2009
Posts: 38
Location: Pirkkala, Finland
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| Posted: Thu Aug 20, 2009 8:13 pm Post subject: |
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How does the air suspended story continue? Did you find good solutions?
Apparently this http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G6XFb6teiNE
thing was good enough to drive to Most, somebody please tell how it is done. |
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Olli
Soviet-Finn Photoshoper
Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2146
Location: Soviet-Finland
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duck-tuc
Dropped
Joined: 02 Dec 2010
Posts: 172
Location: belgium
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| Posted: Fri Jun 01, 2012 12:11 am Post subject: |
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there is more info on this 2cv with the air?
just pictures or movies?
I'm also thinking of making it to stabbing
of this crazy belgian? |
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Wout
Dropped
Joined: 16 Sep 2008
Posts: 380
Location: Arendonk, Belgium
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| Posted: Sat Jun 02, 2012 4:01 pm Post subject: |
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Ask Nico (Crazy belgian).
He knows everything about it and his rides works really nice. |
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