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Godspeed
Snailer


Joined: 08 Nov 2009
Posts: 33
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chewie wrote:
What are they doing ??? Driving with water ???

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ntTrXBYdNQs&feature=related


Interesting link.
It a re-use of exhast gas.
Before putting the exhaust gas to the inlet, they pass it by a sort of tube system with water that gets the exhaust gas in a different state.
I don't understand the details but there is an other webpage that explains it a bit. Fuel consumption decreases a lot.

Very interesting site, but I wonder if it is a hoax or not.
It seems to be one of the "inventions" blocked by the automobile and Petrol industry Question .

Cool stuf would like to try it actually.
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Bart
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Joined: 17 Jun 2007
Posts: 781
Location: Södertälje

PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't understand the speaking in the video as my French is pretty close to zero.. however;
Godspeed wrote:
It seems to be one of the "inventions" blocked by the automobile and Petrol industry Question .

I don't understand the details but there is an other webpage that explains it a bit. Fuel consumption decreases a lot.

Idea Last bit says everything really Sad
It is not "one of those inventions" blocked by the automotive and petrol industry...

Godspeed wrote:
It a re-use of exhast gas.

Before putting the exhaust gas to the inlet, they pass it by a sort of tube system with water that gets the exhaust gas in a different state.

It is a technique found in (almost) every modern engine, called Exhaust Gas Recirculation, short EGR, mostly cooled as done in the movie.

As to weather this really improves a 2cv engine, could be with the right adjustments. However I wouldn't be too worried as EGR @ full load causes a performance loss on pertol engines.
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Godspeed
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Joined: 08 Nov 2009
Posts: 33
Location: Belgium

PostPosted: Thu Dec 30, 2010 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Bart,

My comment was only to support Chewie in the understanding what they are talking about in the video. (I'm not a believer but open for the idea)
I don't disagree with what you are saying, but this claims to be more then an EGR. The video actually doesn't explain much.

The main info comes from this site:
http://www.quanthomme.info/qhsuite/GillierPantoneDe2004a2010/SystemesPantoneFranceMemo.htmhttp://www.quanthomme.info/qhsuite/GillierPantoneDe2004a2010/aut2.htm

EGR is actually reducing the cylinder volume by using exhaust as an inet gas. (There is more but this is the main effect to my understanding).

This is "said" to be different. This would put H2 and extra O in the engine.
The guy said the engine went from 15Hp to 20Hp ( I would like to see this on one of my spare engines :-) ).

Some more info on the subject, it explains it a bit in English. (sort of a commercial of the book that should explain everything)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tHUwLh7kIZo&feature=related

To find more info you can type in google GEET engine or Paul Pantone.

I can find as many pro as con stories on the net untill now.
Look at this video but also the comments with this video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adqtuj_kGC8&feature=related

Bart, I urge you to read more about it. It is interesting but might be a hoax and a waste of time aswell.
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Bart
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Joined: 17 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 1:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had a closer look at it. What they actually try to do is make damp/moist air, using the heat of the exhaust and force that into the manifold, using the pressure in the exhaust.

There are people saying that an engine has more performance when running on very humid air. It maybe true, however I always thought like this; conventional combustion needs oxigen to burn hydrocarbon(s), running on humid air gives less oxigen and results in less power.
It may however be that humid air influences the combustion process such that the process becomes more efficient.
The idea of making hydrogen out of humid air and than getting a better performance seems unrealistic to me. Cause to make hydrogen you split the H2O (costing a lot of energy) and than letting it react back to H2O again would normally not give an energy gain.

That the guy with the 2cv finds a better fuel consumption is no surprise to me. He fitted a smaller carb, causing less performance and less fuel consumption.

Finally that they find the engine to have better emissions on the analyser is logic as well. They heat the water damp air up in the exhaust, so they cool the exhaust gas. This causing HC (and prob other) emissions to condensate in the exhaust and not showing up on the analyser.
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Chewie
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Joined: 29 May 2009
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Location: Eggenfelden, Germany

PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think, sometimes it is not neccesary to create an effective thing, but a cool one. I think it is very cool to build an engine which can run with a half of water and half fuel.

Maybe you know Daniel Dingel ... he is from the Philippines and he says, that he is able to run his engine only with water ... Shocked

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n_WJfFzBe28&feature=related
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motomotie
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Joined: 29 Jun 2009
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Location: hengelo NL

PostPosted: Fri Dec 31, 2010 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chewie wrote:
I think, sometimes it is not neccesary to create an effective thing, but a cool one.


Mr. Green
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marcusj
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Joined: 25 Jul 2010
Posts: 177

PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2011 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

OK - it's about motorbikes - but it sums up EVERYTHING!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VGn6Reru5uk

(headphones on, volume way up!)

/Marcus
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josh d
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Joined: 29 Oct 2010
Posts: 189
Location: chichester uk

PostPosted: Sun Jan 02, 2011 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

me and my dad were thinking of making somthing like this out of a 2cv.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0e-mBOa3r3c&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQtW-eMPnto&feature=related
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http://www.wix.com/joshuadraper/stuff#!

www.artof2cv.co.uk
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Chewie
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Location: Eggenfelden, Germany

PostPosted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:32 pm    Post subject: Offerings to the god of speed Reply with quote

Your videos reminds me to the true story of Burt Munro, who made a speed record with his 1920´s Indian Scout Cool

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jW61Qiko4sg&feature=related
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Bart
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Joined: 17 Jun 2007
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Chewie wrote:
I think it is very cool to build an engine which can run with a half of water and half fuel.
Confused sorry, but is not particurly clever..., you can't run an engine (half) on water, as you can't burn it Idea

But if you prefer to be stupid, I'll let you.
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josh d
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 7:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Offerings to the god of speed Reply with quote

Chewie wrote:
Your videos reminds me to the true story of Burt Munro, who made a speed record with his 1920´s Indian Scout Cool

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jW61Qiko4sg&feature=related


thats an amazing film probley were i got the idear from
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its nice..... high five....

http://www.wix.com/joshuadraper/stuff#!

www.artof2cv.co.uk
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motomotie
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Joined: 29 Jun 2009
Posts: 207
Location: hengelo NL

PostPosted: Mon Jan 03, 2011 8:49 pm    Post subject: Re: Offerings to the god of speed Reply with quote

Chewie wrote:
Your videos reminds me to the true story of Burt Munro, who made a speed record with his 1920´s Indian Scout Cool

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jW61Qiko4sg&feature=related


I like that movie a lot!

Only builders understand that presure to create 'some thing...'
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Chewie
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Joined: 29 May 2009
Posts: 112
Location: Eggenfelden, Germany

PostPosted: Thu Jan 20, 2011 3:04 pm    Post subject: Tererow ... Rust´n´Dust Reply with quote

Thats cool :-)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVzgvIsr7ag&feature=related
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Etienne
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Joined: 25 May 2007
Posts: 2829

PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 12:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This german meeting was one the best of this last year of what I heard !
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Chewie
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Joined: 29 May 2009
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Location: Eggenfelden, Germany

PostPosted: Fri Jan 21, 2011 1:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don´t know if "La Belle" would be finished to the nex date Sad
If I haven´t got the suitable Snail for the "Dresden-Breslau Rallye" I would start at Teterow´s "Rus´n´Dust"

http://www.rustndust.de/
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