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cheap and better ignition-coil alternatives?
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Malte
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 8:41 pm    Post subject: cheap and better ignition-coil alternatives? Reply with quote

just looking for some cheap ignition-coil alternatives.

there is a new one at derfranzose.de, but much to expensive.

just trying to find the same one cheaper :)

do you have any ideas / experiences with coils?

what is the resistance of the black coil?

thanks for you help!
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Bart
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 19, 2010 9:02 pm    Post subject: Re: cheap and better ignition-coil alternatives? Reply with quote

Malte wrote:
just looking for some cheap ignition-coil alternatives.
Just don't drive at all.... (there is no such thing as a free lunch Wink )

No on a serious note, a good secondhand one is the cheapest.
I don't know the Franzose coil, but the yellow harley coils, very commun in the UK, are definataly good. Than again they are about 70 pounds, so you end up with about 100 Euros including postage.
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dyanut
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Location: North Yorkshire

PostPosted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Malte,
one of my customers has been using one of these coils on his 2CV for at least 4 years.
< http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250594854389&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT#ht_500wt_975 >
The primary resistance is slightly lower than the 3.5 ohms of the standard 2CV black coil and even though he didn't fit a 1 ohm ballast resistor in series with the coil, it's all working fine...

I'd been using standard Harley coils for points ignition on my cars, like this item on Ebay, but have now bought one of the Kwacker type to try out.
< http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230455763781&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT#ht_500wt_975 >
Those 31609-65A Harley coils are 'around' 4.5 to 5 ohms, btw.

ken
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backfire
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 20, 2010 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just buy yourself a second hand honda cb coil from between 1969 and 1979, cheap and easy to get, but use the coil from the four cilinder versions. They all have correct ohm and twin spark.
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Malte
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 1:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks!

do they work with my 123 iginition?
don't want to kill it!
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backfire
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PostPosted: Wed Apr 21, 2010 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

that depends on what 123 ignition you are using, there is a version that works with both Visa and 2CV coil, because Visa coil is also lower Ohm then 2cv Coil. But if you are using 123 ignition that you can only use with Visa ccil, then you should look for 1980-1990 honda's with CDI ignition, als twin spark coils and cheap and plenty.
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Malte
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

you mean, "if you are using the 123 that can only be used with 2CV-black coil" ?
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backfire
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No original 123 waas designed to be used with Visa coil, later they made an other version that could be used wth 2cv or Visa coil. If I am not mistaken it is the blue version that can be used with both coils. But easy to check on der franzose,de Wink
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Malte
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PostPosted: Thu Apr 22, 2010 8:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

i think thats not correct.

123 for 2cv can be used with black coil

1234 uni = black coil!

only 123 evo can be used with black and brown one!

be careful!!!!!!!!
if you use the brown coil with the brown one, you will fuck up you ignition!
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Blackjack
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 07, 2011 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

123 ignition is a waste of money.

I now use a Boyer Brandsen - this gives the points a longer life and gets rid of the condensor (quality of these is piss poor now). I also use two 12v Ford coils - these are cheap, good quality ones are easy to find and they never, ever overheat. Another benefit is that one coil per cylinder gives a very strong spark and you can make the HT leads very short.

A great advantage of this set up is it uses standard parts - you can leave the condensor fitted but not powered up and if you have any problems with the Boyer Brandsen you can simply bypass it with a loop of wire.

Total cost of this set up is around £40. Buy them from Premier Wiring tell Alan what you're using them for and he'll send you the right ones. The wiring diagram was developed by a member of the club I run. He was a highly qualified electrical engineer for the MOD and he looked at all the options - wiring in series, in parallel, 6 or 12 volt. He also has testing and metering equipment not available to most people. After a lot of testing, this was what he came up with and my car has done 60,000+ miles on it - other members have done many miles too with no ignition problems and no collapsing coils.

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EirikJ
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 12:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Franzose coil's look like a Dyna-coil. I've read that Dyna has a good reputation, but I dont know.

I think this is the coil that Franzose is selling?(studied the pictures):

http://www.cruisercustomizing.com/detail.cfm?Category_ID=91&manufacturer_ID=275&product_ID=13747&sblid_name=Dyna_Performance_Dynatek_Miniature_Series_Coil_____Outputs____Coil&model_id=0


Malte is correct regarding the 123-ignition.
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kadaver
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

about the 123-ignition and the kind of coil that can be used:

since a year or 2 every new 123-ignition can be used with both black and brown coils. the standard, uni, evo... don't matter. i've been driving the last 2 years with a standard 123-ignition in combination with a brown visa-coil and it has'nt caused any trouble.
because it supposed to give a better spark, but primarily because of the bad quality of the black 2cv-coils.

but, older 123-ignitions can not all be used with visa-coil. only the evo-123 can i believe.

the problem is; you can't see if you have a 'new' or 'old' 123 on the outside of the housing... you'll have to check with Albertronic (the guy who developed the thing).
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Bart
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 08, 2011 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

EirikJ wrote:
The Franzose coil's look like a Dyna-coil. I've read that Dyna has a good reputation, but I dont know.

I think this is the coil that Franzose is selling?(studied the pictures):

http://www.cruisercustomizing.com/detail.cfm?Category_ID=91&manufacturer_ID=275&product_ID=13747&sblid_name=Dyna_Performance_Dynatek_Miniature_Series_Coil_____Outputs____Coil&model_id=0
Just installed a "Franzose" coil last weekend and it is identical to the dyna coil in the link.
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S O S
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 24, 2011 11:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There are quite a few "own brand" ( re boxed dyna coils) on the net in USA from some of the big Harley stores-depending on currency values they can be cheap if they will post to EU.

Just make sure the primary resistance is 3-4 Ohms for coil and old 123/DG

S
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rosemary
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PostPosted: Mon Apr 11, 2011 10:44 pm    Post subject: Thanks. This sounds great. Ill ring alan tomorrow. Reply with quote

Blackjack wrote:
123 ignition is a waste of money.

I now use a Boyer Brandsen - this gives the points a longer life and gets rid of the condensor (quality of these is piss poor now). I also use two 12v Ford coils - these are cheap, good quality ones are easy to find and they never, ever overheat. Another benefit is that one coil per cylinder gives a very strong spark and you can make the HT leads very short.

A great advantage of this set up is it uses standard parts - you can leave the condensor fitted but not powered up and if you have any problems with the Boyer Brandsen you can simply bypass it with a loop of wire.

Total cost of this set up is around £40. Buy them from Premier Wiring tell Alan what you're using them for and he'll send you the right ones. The wiring diagram was developed by a member of the club I run. He was a highly qualified electrical engineer for the MOD and he looked at all the options - wiring in series, in parallel, 6 or 12 volt. He also has testing and metering equipment not available to most people. After a lot of testing, this was what he came up with and my car has done 60,000+ miles on it - other members have done many miles too with no ignition problems and no collapsing coils.

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